Friday, January 17, 2014

hyv3mynd vs the New Tyranid Codex


So here we are, a week after the newest tyranid codex release.  If you read this blog, chances are you read many blogs and discussion forums all dedicated to wh40k.  If this is the case, you've been exposed to hundreds of opinions, analysts, winging, praising, and soapboxing about the new book.  I've been silent about the topic on this blog and I don't want certain emotions and arguments to dominate the atmosphere, so this will be my one and only post on this topic.



By now, we've heard the whole spectrum of responses from "it's worse than the last book" to "it's perfectly balanced for 6th, despite being weaker than tau/eldar".  Everyone seems to be a tyranid expert all of a sudden, even those who don't own a single gant or never had to move over 100 models a turn.  I'm going to try and keep this a reflection from my perspective as undoubtedly others will challenge any blanket claims and statements from high atop their white horses.

If you're not familiar with my hobby MO, I am a competitive player by definition.  Due to the work schedules my wife and I keep to provide for our 2 year old son, I play one tournament a month and about one casual game every 3 months.  So taking that approach to the new book, I already see that the new book will cause me problems.  As it is and has been, I typically finish one out of three tournament games with tyranids.  The new book will allow us to use about 20% more models, which actually makes the army more difficult to play in a timed setting.  Looking at the nerf to IB, psychic powers, and lack of new rules and mechanics, I would be playing 20% more models that are actually less fun to play.

Took my bugs out for one last run at our monthly tournament.  Game #1 relic vs SM was a big win.
Looking over the rules changes in the new book leaves me only with a bad taste in my mouth.  1/2 of each instinctive behavior failure results for feed and lurk can cause damage to the unit or the unit to flee right off the table.  They've taken away biomancy and with it, any chance to have eternal warrior on anything in the book.  While the new powers aren't the worst out there, flyrants and tervigons without t7-9 and/or eternal warrior are a joke in today's shooting meta.

Game #2 was a 4 objective crusade vs serpent spam.  Joke of a game, the only thing I killed was a wraithknight which my opponent graciously fed me.  If he hadn't, I wouldn't have killed a single model.
Next is the removal of mycetic spores (and other units), which makes us the only army in the game without transports.  They didn't fix trygon tunnels, removed the only unit that can assault from reserves, and didn't add any new deployment options.  This means we're also now the slowest army in the game as our only non-FMC units that can move 12" are pretty bad.  Now consider our most popular toughness value is 3 with 6+ armor, toughness 4 with 5+ armor, or t6 with 3+ armor and no invuln, and (IMO) we are the most fragile army in the game.  People will say "... yeah but MC's...".  If you've been playing at all since tau and eldar came out, you know exactly how long a t6 3+ MC will last.  This month's tournament was 1,000pts and I brought 2 tervigons and 2 trygons, even getting Iron Arm 3/4 games I lost 1 tervigon game 1, all 4 MC's game 2, 3 MC's game 3, and 3 MC's game 4. 

Game #3 was purge vs tau.  I actually managed to lose several assaults against the riptide, commander, and vespids (!) and get creamed 6-3 by the bottom of turn 5 when I conceded.
The new rules, units, and relics are uninspiring at best.  Anyone championing a 40pt crown that gives +6" synapse and no additional combat or shooting ability needs to get their head checked.  For about the same points a tau commander can take 3-4 signature systems each of which trumps a basic rule of the shooting phase?  For the same points an eldar character can get stealth, shrouded, rerolled cover saves, and hit-and-run.  For the same points, a space marine can get 3++ and eternal warrior. 

Game #4 I conceded on turn 3 when dual dreadknights had already nearly tabled me getting off every force weapon activation despite SiTW.  Two heavy incinerators and two gatling psilencers made short work of my gants.
What it comes down to for me is GW didn't give me any incentive to update my tyranids.  I couldn't finish timed tournament games with the old book so I definitely won't be able to now.  Less deployment options, no transports, everything worth playing still moves 6".  Psykers got worse with the removal of biomancy, they didn't fix the units that needed fixing, and 3/4 new units just won't hold water.  A single quad gun has a reasonable chance of taking out a harpy/crone.  A single skyray can drop a flyrant without breaking a sweat.  The haruspex... if you've ever played tyranids I don't need to go over a t6 3+ MC that moves 6" a turn and only has ws3 and 3 attacks.  The exocrine really appeals to me, but not so much as to inspire me to actually play the army. 

Here's my prediction based on playing tyranids since 2010.  Barring some epic supplement or dataslate, the army becomes the worst in the entire game, underperforming sisters, orks, and whoever else.  While other armies are getting new transports and rules such as battle focus, supporting fire, and chapter tactics, tyranids will stand there eating themselves or running off the table.  Some hardcore competitive types may make a build or two work, but when meta lists and playstyles evolve, the army will become easier to beat than before.  No more drop pods means every 35pt rhino or sacrificial unit delays tyranids for assaulting the important stuff one turn earlier.  Roadblock tactics and focusing down the synapse units will turn tyranids into a competitive laughing stock.

Honestly, I'm crushed.  They were my first fully painted army.  The first army I ever won a tournament with.  I didn't need another eldar-esque army, just one that excites me.  GW has failed in a truly stunning form.  I'm happy that some people remain determined to make the army work, I just hope they find enjoyment along the way and don't look back after months or years at the time and money invested being a waste.

I'm not looking for a huge debate here.  People have already formed their opinions and very few people at this point will be influenced by anything but actual results.  I apologize to fans and followers who had hoped for more tyranid content, but from where I sit, there's no incentive to actually give them a shot.  At this point in my hobby journey, I've collected grey knights, dark eldar, eldar, CSM, daemons, some necrons, and some tau.  Every one of those armies is more fun and rewarding for me to play.

I hate to be such a downer, especially on my own blog.  That's why I said this will be my one and only post on this topic.  Here's a pretty pic of my chaos spawn conversions I've been repainting so we don't finish on a sour note.  My intent is to finish up the project I started last year utilizing Typhus, zombies, and spawn but re-balanced with tau allies.


22 comments:

  1. I agree on all points about nids ... also, those Spawn are incredible! Great use of bits and smooth transitions between each element!

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    1. Thanks TJ, that means a lot coming from such a chaos afficionado. There's a more detailed tutorial of the conversion process here: http://synaps3.blogspot.com/2013/04/best-practise-sculpting-with-glues-for.html

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  2. I don't know if you remember me, I messaged you about my 2012 WGC stealershock list (http://synaps3.blogspot.com/2012/06/email-nids-for-wargamescon.html) and used some of your advice to tweak my list. I ended up making it to table 10 and drawing with Greg Sparks (Who was awesome to play against) footdar before playing like a chump and getting bitch slapped by Paul Murphy's Draigowing.

    I think I played somewhere in the range of 250-300 games with Tyranids in 5th edition, about 2/3 of those being tournament or tournament prep games. In 6th edition I played probably 50-75 games with Tyranids before I got totally burnt out on the boring monobuild and awful 6th edition competitive playset and retired to casual play.

    That being said, I agree with you 100%. This new book is an absolute travesty, and it really broke my heart to see them phone it in on such a key book. If this book had been a Tau/Eldar book, we would've been looking at a huge meta shift and likely all sorts of new combinations from every book. Hell, if we had gotten a C:SM/Daemons book we would've been thrilled with interesting options and playability despite still having rougher matchups at high competitive levels. You know, I honestly would've even accepted a DA/CSM book where our options largely remained the same, we got a few new interesting models and we got an almost across the board points reduction. Instead we LOST units from our book, we LOST playability options, we LOST customization, we LOST viability, and honestly, our price 'cuts' are mostly in place on units who were overpriced to begin with (Championing carnifexes going down to 120 as a great idea should be viewed instead as them fixing a mistake, not giving us a gift).

    It's insulting to think an entire 'design team' of professionals can churn out what is nothing more than the 5th edition book split into 5 sections, given to 5 different authors who edited it how they saw fit, then brought back together and published without any communication or collaboration between the lot of them.

    Looks like I'll be homebrewing my own book for my friends and I. Maybe I'll have the decency to send it to GW so they can publish it for free. I'd bet every penny I have it'd be better received than their original.

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    1. Hi ToT, and yes I remember our discussions and following your progress on dakka. I've also had the opportunity of facing Sparks, Paul Murphy, and Goatboy all with my nids. One thing you notice once you get out of your "small pond" meta is that top tier tournament players know exactly how to counter tyranids. They're literally the easiest army in the game to counter due to slow speed, lack of resilience, and lack of "tricknology". The net result of the new book is even less speed (well fleet across every unit is ok, but no more podding fexes, zoans, or devilgaunts), less resilience (no iron arm, no invulns, no EW), and less tricknology with the nerf to tervigons and spawning.

      I've mulled over writing/calling GW myself, but at the end of the day what will it do? I've resolved a while back to live my life in a positive manner and focus less on the negative. I'm not going to sit here and cry about what they could have been, I'll just shelf them and play the armies that are actually well thought out and fun to play.

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    2. So very true. It's sad to see them in such a state.

      If you're interested, I'll shoot you a copy of the homebrew dex when I'm finished. I doubt you'll get much use out of it with the way you play, but I'd like your feedback on it if you're willing to take the time to read it.

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  3. It truely is terrible, buffed Space Marines, followed by buffed Tryanids would have basically been the ability to print money for GW, instead of loosing a quarter of their stock price(I know nids aren't part of that report but next half looks worse). I don't understand how an army that was only competitive because of 6th edition rules needed to be nerfed in every facet of the army.
    The old book was bad enough that GW prioritizes re-doing them over any number of older books, and then make it worse? Time to switch to non-toxic hobby glue in the GW offices.

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    1. Yeah I was really surprised to see millions in profits dropped over last year in the GW financials, especially due to the increased release speeds and media types. However, they did kick independent retailers in the nuts with the new regulations, and a lot of the rapid fire releases haven't been quality products. DA speeders and flyers, tau flyers, howling banshees, etc etc.

      There's so many opportunities for them to return to profitability, all they need is quality, balanced rules that actually make all models viable. GW can only hide behind the "beer and pretzels" shield so long. What they need to realize is that internal balance, external balance, universally viable units, and a ruleset suitable for competitive play would be so much more profitable than their lazy "beer and pretzels" excuse for not providing quality products.

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  4. I wouldn't read too much into the stock price drop just yet. Regardless - fantastic post. The questions I keep coming back to with the new codex are "is this something I want to try?" and "is this fun?" and the answer is no. I've thrown together a dozen different lists and simply can't find the points or the slots for both troops and synapse for anything I'd enjoy playing. I'll keep trying for a little while, but hope isn't gonna last much longer - and trying to fix things with dataslate formations is BULL****

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  5. As someone who has been playing Nids for many years, and often in a competitive scene such as against Nova top players, I have played them less and less leading up to no. I was hoping for a good reason to start playing them again. But it doesn't look like that is the case, I saved over $200 now, didn't even buy the codex. I'm going to play in two Tyranid themed Apoc games to celebrate the release cause they were already scheduled, but they will probably be my only games. I'm writing a fandex to play with my casual crowd, cause that is the only crowd I would even bother playing nids against as it stands.

    Granted I have still rocked some local tournaments with them, but that is against a friendlier crowd, and due to my skill and experience with them. Then at the same time I can get tabled by a friendly Ravenwing army. What erks me the most are non-nid players telling me that it isn't bad. Cause they haven't tried running Tervigons or mass gaunts 36" to an objective.

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    1. I haven't read any of the new codex but if it's that bad, i guess in the grim darkness of the far future there is only thwart...

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  6. Lemme guess, you are also boohooing over the loss off the most undercosted/overpowered unit ever (Doom of Malan’tai)?

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    1. Nope. You can dig back through 4 years of blogging here and you won't find me using the DoM in a single tournament game. Since you came to my home and felt the need to liken my feedback to the crying of a child about a unit I didn't use, maybe you'd also like to know out of 2 years building my tyranid collection and over 20 tournaments with them from local RTTs to Daboyz Gt and the ATC, I've only ever used 2 tervigons and 1 flyrant.

      Since you don't seem to have any empathy about the butchering of the tyranid codex, and know so much about what is overpowered and underpriced, maybe you can share some thoughts that are actually constructive about the new book? Or maybe you'll crawl back under the bridge and stop wasting everyone's time?

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    2. Yeah, overpowered... DoM did an average of 1.4 wounds to a Ld10 unit. Gee... how deadly is that?
      If DoM landed within range of 2 Ld 9 units, there was a 25% chance of a complete wiff. Game breaking I tell you....

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    3. Not to mention he statistically died to 3 S8 wounds (not uncommon)

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  7. I remember reading some of your tactics on the Tyranid Hive and somehow stumbled upon your blog. I really wish I had some compelling counterargument, some secret recipe for success that revealed itself to me upon reading the codex. Unfortunately, the codex is every bit as sloppily created as you, and a great many others have pointed out. Tyranids is my only army and the mere notion of four more years of mediocrity is rather crushing. Anyway, great post. I hope our kids grow up to play a better game.

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    1. There are definitely options if they're your only army. I'd highly recommend resisting lictors and mawlocs depending on how much of which sites you read.

      If I didn't have other armies to fall back on, I'd be focusing on 2 exocrines and 2 crones as a core. Experimenting with mixed gant units, MSU warriors, and a double flamer tfex or triple dakkafex brood.

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  8. This is a very well reasoned and put together discussion on the Tyranids codex. My first army was Sisters of Battle - and as I played more, and got better, I became frustrated with the limitations of the Witch Hunters codex. My thought was it played too linear - I drove up rhinos, hopped out, shot and had very limited options to attack an opponent from multiple directions.

    I switched to Daemons for that capability, and they maintained it through their new iteration due to Deep Strike, Scout and Outflank. I feel like Tyranids are similar in terms of your review (I know Hive Commander can outflank a unit) but they do not provide compelling and exciting deployment options. The ability to Infiltrate Stealers, setup Ymargls and put a pod in a location to keep an opponent honest, to punish deployment/movement mistakes and to take advantage of list imbalances is not there.

    I also empathize with the model count aspect - assaults take a long time in 6th edition due to overwatch, initiative step pile ins and challenges. I have only finished 1 in 5 tournaments games on average with Daemons naturally - I cannot imagine the same for Daemons.

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  9. I'm very sorry to hear about your disappointment in this codex. I was looking forward to seeing you get a fresh codex and seeing what new painting theme it inspired for you. Some of my most memorable games at millennium tournaments were facing your tyranids. I cross my fingers this is not a herald of what is to come in the next Imperial Guard Codex. It is my one and only army and I do not plan on starting any others. If it's bad I will just have to grit my teeth and play through to the next one. I hope that something comes through in the supplements that helps you out.

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  10. One thing that I find disappointing is the distribution of what should be in the codex over a few months. For instance, The last codex was ~$30. The current dex is $50 (codex) + $15 (1st supplement) + the next 2 supplements. That's quite a bit of a jump for some thing that could be put together in 1 release. I love the idea of supplements, but when they're released within a few weeks of eachother I feel a bit slighted. Have a huge release and then a year out, let's have some additional content, not just more of the same.

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    1. Crispy I hear you. It is a veiled price hike. Most people keep denying this fact, but I mean come on. They easily could have put the one or two lictor and genestealer rules in their section, but they would rather charge 50+15+15+15 for content that really adds nothing and should be in the core book. I play IG and I am already prepared for certain rules and units to vanish and for things like doctrines to be placed in additional DLC.

      GW, fix the game and I will spend money on your stuff, stop trying to leverage me with your cheap rules.

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  11. Three months down the line, I'm still having success with my 1995pts list. Granted, my meta has a ban on Battlebrothers (Allies of Convenience) and all digital releases of course, so I see no deathstars, formations or Escalation.

    Dakka Flyrant
    Dakka Flyrant - Hive Commander

    Venomthrope

    30 Gants
    30 Gants
    Tervigon
    Tervigon - Miasma Cannon, thorax weapon of choice (outflanking)

    Hive Crone
    Hive Crone
    Hive Crone

    Mawloc
    Mawloc
    Biovore

    Comms Relay

    1995

    The codex is still a sad mess of lost opportunity and ripped out flavour. Lack of spores, Ymgarls and charging from outflank makes the army dull as dirt. The only real choice is - what do I take in the Heavy slot?

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