My first game was against IG with GK allies (libby + 5 terminators). We played mission #6 The Relic (kill the carrier). Deployment was Dawn of War (the new pitched battle).
I rolled up psy powers (missed the part where it was all or nothing swap so my tyrant kept paroxysm). Everything went biomancy. Tyrant and tervigon (tervigon kept catalyst also illegal) both got Life Leech (str6 ap2 ass2, regens wounds). Broodlord got Iron Arm (d3 str/t + EW) and Endurance (FnP, regen, relentless). Luckily I got to go first and get my powers off.
Important to note here (which we didn't for the game) units with skyfire (hydras) that do not have interceptor (don't think hydras do) fire at bs1 against non flyer/skimmers. Great balancing for hydras.
Perils offer no saves of any kind now so no invulns. Commander abilities are cool. I got one for my Tyrant that allows friendly units within 12" to roll an extra run dice and choose the highest. Fleet also allows you to reroll runs.
Shooting phases hurt us more now with most cover being 5+ and FnP being 5+. The good news is night fight gives stealth from 12-24", even to MC's. It also grants shrouding from 24-36" which stacks with stealth so MC's further than 24" that are covered by 25% have 2+ cover during night fight.
Preferred enemy (old adversary) now affects shooting. It allows rerolls of 1's in shooting and cc, HITS AND WOUNDS! So tl devourers hit on 4+ with reroll (for tl), then wound MEQ on 2+ with rerolls (1's) thanks to PE. Don't forget unsaved wounds go from the front. Add enfeeble psychic power and you're ID'ing nobz, paladins, etc.
My trygon failed its assault range even with fleet rerolls. On the right, my broodlord's unit also failed to get a 9 on 2d6 with rerolls. Reserves are always 3+ on t2/3 and auto t4. That means hive commander is always 2+ (I didn't have it these games).
Important to note that only SiTW, Runes, and Runic weapons are the only way to block blessings (FnP, iron arm, endurance). SiTW also stopped force activation this turn.
Flyers will be really annoying, especially if they bring 2-3. I couldn't pen it with the 1 hit I got from hive guard (hit on 6's, reroll 1's for PE).
My tfex did wreck one hydra through hull point removal which was cool. That would have still been alive in 5th ed. My broodlord survived shooting for 3 turns (his genestealers did not), buffed himself to s7/t7 and wrecked the manticore via hull points also. In that back corner, the s3 lasguns also couldn't even hurt him and he survived plasma and autocannon shots with ease.
We didn't finish the game but I was losing badly. I could have gotten a draw if the tyrant + tfex could have killed the termies (halberds and swords are ap3 now, both MC's had 2+ and are ap2) but we stopped at the top of 4.
I also played a game against a (now broken) DE WWP list. The mission was #3 The Big Guns Never Tire (d3+2 objectives, hvy support can score even vehicles). Joe didn't bring any hvy support at 1500pts heh.
Deployment was Vanguard Stike (diagonal line from corner to corner, 12" from the line) which is really annoying to lay out. This time I did psy powers correctly. Broodlord got Endurance and Life Leech. Interesting thing here is he is bs0 so cannot use shooting powers. Nothing indicates being able to replace this power so he was screwed. I kept him in back to buff the army. Tervigon got Warp Speed (d3init/attacks, fleet) and Life Leech. Tyrant got Enfeeble (-1str/t, everything is difficult) and Life Leech.
You can now only reserve half of your units (rounded up) so Joe's WWP plan has to change. Luckily for him, he seized. Beasts now fully ignore terrain, but the wording for assaulting is "if any model had to move into terrain, the unit is init1" so as far as I see, they still strike last.
Units can only disembark if their transport moves 6", but they get a 6" regular move from the hull after. Also, fast skimmers can still move up to 18" in the shooting phase and earn a 4+ jink (5+ if they don't flat out in shooting). He drops a WWP.
12" move + 18" flat out is far...
But my tervigon gives itself fleet and + 2 attacks with Warp Speed.
My tfex (with preferred enemy) explodes the flanking skimmer and the hive guard (with preferred enemy) explode the central skimmer. Did you know explosions are always str4 on embarked units now despite open topped?
So the fleet tervigon with 5 base attacks, furious charge, and poison assaults (muahahah). There are 2 flesh gauntles in there but I pass my saves.
Grotesques arrive via the WWP but are not allowed to assault. Joe built these with daemon prince models and bits from necrons and fansasy models. His full unit has a retail value of nearly $800 lol. Beasts moved to within 4" of my tyrant, but his assault roll was 3" and he got a reroll (from fleet) of 3" and failed his assault. By the wording, I still would have gotten my 12 tl shots on overwatch, but I forgot hah.
I assault the tfex and ymgarls into the grotesques. Funny thing is huskblades are now ap3 so the tfex was mostly safe. Plus, Joe's dice are always awesome. Here's his Archon attacks against the ws3 tfex.
I had to get home to the wife and kid so we called it but things were going well for Nids this game. On the drive home, I also realized that I forgot Fear on the MC's as well as impact hits in both games.
Here's what I took away from my first two practice matches:
MC's are better, tyranid infantry got worse (from cover, FnP, rapid fire at 24", and overwatch)
Biomancy is great and could be the key to new competitive Nids (until everyone brings a farseer ally)
Preferred enemy is auto-include for me. Reroll 1's in shooting and assault to hit and to wound.
Poisoned MC's can wound on 2+ and reroll 2+ (s6 vs t4).
TL Decourers (MC version) are even better vs mech.
Aegis defense lines may be the key to keeping genestealers viable. You can place them anywhere in your half for 4+ cover.
Fearless is very good now. No more resolution wounds.
Multi-assaults are very bad now. You lose the assault bonus and furious charge (and can't stack wounds to cause no retreats on tougher targets).
Some things I'm considering testing next:
235pt+ tervigons. 3 biomancy powers, crushing claws, toxins and adrenals. If you get warp speed, you can go up to 10 attacks (3 base, +d3 claws, +d3 warp speed). If you get Iron Arm, you can go up to str9(10 on assault)/t9, eternal warrior.
Commando Broodlords (BL + 4 stealers). 2 biomancy powers for 116pts. Backfield scoring/buffing unit.
Dakkafexes possibly in spores. Come in on 2+ with Hive Commander, nuff said.
Zoanthropes with biomancy? Random generated power can screw you, but imagine 3x endurance. Blessings are cast in the movement phase and each zoan could bless a different unit. Life Leech isn't terrible at str6 ap2. Psy powers are cumulative so 3x enfeeble would be funny. Str1/t1 terminators/paladins/nobz?
Tarpit hordes instead of CC hordes. 30 gaunts now stick around forever in assault since no retreat wounds are gone. Hormagaunts and Gargoyles are tons better.
Deathleaper. FAQ'd for shrouding which stacks with stealth (+3 total). 2+ cover in any terrain, -d3 leadership for all the psykers about to come out to play.
Raveners. 12" move 2d6" assault with rerolls, ignoring all terrain. ws5 i5 scything, and rending. Nuff said.
Anyways, that's it for now. Feel free to share your thoughts and feelings on 6th ed (nids). My DE are getting shelved until I can figure out how to unbreak them and I know the GK will be fine.
I agree, MC's are indeed better. I wonder if an all Godzilla list is viable at his point. MC's might get a 5+ cover in area terrain now and twin linked devourers should shred the hull points off anything armor 12 or less.
ReplyDeleteNids should expect to see more units deployed outside of transports now. I wonder if that makes the Doom in a Pod more deadly than ever. Outflanking stealers are hurt with no assaulting out of reserve so they would have to infiltrate more ( in big groups).
I'm impressed with the buffs the Tervigon can get with Biomancy. This can make them extremely formidable in assaults. 3 of them and a Tyrant MIT be all you need to rush the enemy lines
Yeah the problem comes when it's broken down into competitive form, causes a shift in the meta to where everyone brings a farseer, and the list gets shut down.
ReplyDeleteImperium armies are allies of convenience with Eldar. Allies of convenience treat each ally as an enemy in the rules. That means if imperium armies bring an Eldar Fraser as an ally, the runes if warding power will be working against their own psyker during the game not just yours. I'm not sure you will see very many allied far seers on the tabletop.
DeleteWow, best catch yet. That and hydras being bs1 against ground targets now hah.
DeleteStill, people who don't want to bring a psyker in their main force have access to the best psy defense in the game plus doom.
How did the monsters do against tanks now they do not get 2d6 Penetration? Was the loss of attacks from Smash worth being Str 10?
ReplyDeleteI hate Random Psi Powers but since Biomancy has at least 4 good powers I might take the chance and roll on the table.
Great to see nids with the new psi powers in action!
ReplyDeleteHow domfarseers impact this list?
Pretty badly I fear. I think tervigon spam may be better than broodlords in the long run because they can use the shooting power that regenerates wounds, buy regenerate, and Endurance gives them a wound back on 5+. 3 regen opportunities may outpace the extra perils, but you're better off probably not running more than 4 biomancers to avoid the rock/paper/scissors thing.
DeleteI'll tell you in two weeks hehe. I drafted a list for the July tournament that has 5 psykers and I think they'll all go bio.
All the vehicles I wrecked were from shooting or the broodlord (2 raiders, hydra, and manticore).
ReplyDeleteI haven't done the math yet but here's what I think. MC's with many attacks (trygons, crushing claw tervigons) can wreck a vehicle without smashing but getting 3+ glances. If you only have 4 attacks, you're probably better off smashing and hoping for one solid pen.
I've had one 6th ed game at 2k points, against Space Wolves. Rolled mission #5 (the old draw mission) with mysterious objectives and diagonal deployment. I almost pissed my pants laughing when my opponent discovered that his Longfangs was guarding an exploding objective :D
ReplyDeleteFaced a really hard army, vehicle spam puppies - 2xLongfangs, Runepriest with Jaws, 2 Rifleman Dreads, 5-6 Thunderwolves with Lord, Dakkapred, Rhinos, Razors. Pretty much a list that recently won a big tournament in my region.
And I have to say I love 6th ed so far. I used my un-modified null deployment list and deployed only my Flyrant (later I discovered that you can't reserve everything as at the end of any given turn if you have no models on the table, you lose). It was Night Fighting so my Flyrant was pretty safe (I even rolled the Nightfighting Warlord trait). I was wrecking vehicles to the left and right with 3 podded Dakkafexes, Dakka Flyrant, Zoans, Devilgants. Even the pods popped vehicles (even took the last Hull Point from a Dreadnought with a shot in the back).
Model placement is really important now for Broodlords and such. Shooting is crazy. Devilgants deleted Longfangs (like they usually do) and 30 Devourer shots can hurt even when Overwatching.
The 24" move of the Flyrant was amazing, delivering SitW fast and in the late game doubling back to my home objective and cleansing it from a couple of Hunter squads that were forced to disembark to claim the objective. 24" Swoop + 18" Devourer spam = 42" threat range. This guy will get PE now, as it's silly good for my army. Was shot down and took a wound in the late game, but too late to make a difference.
Vector Strike isn't a viable counter to enemy Fliers, but pretty consistent gives 2 wounds against infantry (no cover saves) which probably puts it slightly above shooting with one of your Devourer guns against power armour. Hammer of Wrath feels a bit weak and gimmicky.
You only need on average 18 shots of anything, to down a Flying MC. And more Skyfire will be added in White Dwarf or FAQ updates, most likely. So you really need target saturation if you want it to have an impact in your games.
We didn't use the new psychic powers, will be looking into that soon. Not keen on rolling Witchfire powers for my BS0 Broodlords though. And Hypnotic Gaze is pretty ace with the new duel rule.
I'm not keen on losing Paroxysm on a Flyrant either. Saved my bacon in this game when I cast it in a crucial turn just as his remaining Thunderwolves were about to take back his objective from my Genestealers. WS 1 didn't end up well for the Thunderwolves. But I don't like the randomness of the the rolls, ending up with Life Leech and Haemorrhage instead of Paroxysm.
Swarmlord, that's were it is when it comes to psychic powers. With 4 rolls and every dupe is a reroll, he's almost guaranteed to grab that power you really need in a certain matchup. Invisibility is crazy good on a deathstar or any unit you really want to keep alive, and Hallucination for the enemy Deathstar.
But Biomancy looks really good as it has more Blessing powers than the other two (Blessings are hard to counter).
Enough ramblings, I'm tired.
I was looking at Raveners but I think that 5 Ymgarls may be better than 3 Raveners for roughly the same price - they can assault from Dormancy and have a better save and as I've stacks of Stealers they're cheaper pocketwise too. They can get more attacks with mutations, though Rage can buff the Raveners to equal if they fail Instinctive behaviour. Rending claws are free, higher initiative, leaderhsip WS and with mutations it can also be +1 be toughness or strength which gives them greater versatility. I guess if you could get it in near an outflanking Broodlord he may be able to do some of the cool buffs you've described to them too.
ReplyDeleteYeah the problem I'm encountering is closer to 2k, the improved utility of deathleaper and zoanthropes makes the elite slot too contested. Mech isn't dead yet so you'll need 1-2 units of hive guard.
Delete"Raveners. 12" move 2d6" assault with rerolls, ignoring all terrain. ws5 i5 scything, and rending. Nuff said."
ReplyDeleteBut they're not Initiative 5 when charging through cover, right?
"To represent this, if at least one model on the charging unit moved through difficult terrain as part of its charge move, all of the unit's models must attack at initiative step 1."
Could someone clarify that for me?
If they could strike at Ini 5... That would be awesome, but I fear it's to good to be true.
You're right, Beasts that go through difficult terrain strike at Initiative 1 still. They must have Offensive Grenades or the equivalent to go at their normal initiative. I know, sad times.
Delete